Saturn Returns - RealPagan- Paganism for the Real World

I'm currently 35, with my fir…

2011-04-08T22:06:50.453Z

I'm currently 35, with my first Saturn return cheerfully behind me. For me, most of the hardest stuff hit when I was 30-32 and it was combined with my 2nd degree in the tradition I follow (which is not a combination I would recommend, in hindsight, though it did have the advantage of clearing out a lot of stuff that wasn't working all at once.)

Between 2005 and 2007, I was:

- Spent nine months with my now-ex-husband unemployed (and, as it turns out tromping all over our relationship agreements.)

- Separating from him.

- Getting my 2nd degree

- Moving 3 times between February 2006 and June 2007

- Going back to grad school to finish my MLIS degree.

- Navigating trying to find a job that used that degree.

- Lots of other complicated changes in my social life, community connections, and much more.

Hey Flammeous... In your li…

2011-04-08T12:13:50.043Z

Hey Flammeous...

In your life, you'll go through at least one, possibly two, more Saturn returns.

The next one will occur around age 57-60 and is commonly thought of in mainstream society as a "mid-life crisis", and biologically also addresses the issue of menopause.

The final one that you might go through will occur in your mid-to-late 80s.

In most cases, neither of these tends to be as significant as the first one, although people who go through a mild first Saturn return seem to get whomped by the second one.

I'm not extremely knowledgeab…

2011-04-08T11:25:11.249Z

I'm not extremely knowledgeable in astrology and I'm coming around to it little by little when various aspects are exposed to me, such as in this instance of Saturn returns and reading the comments.

In evaluating the time frame of ages according to my life, I must say and also picks jaw off the floor, that I went through some major life changes starting exactly at the age of 26.

Not only did I become pregnant for the first time with my daughter, but also managed to have a 2nd child, get married, buy a house, a new car and began working the night shift all within apx. 2 and half year span. I said that right, two and half years, my daughters are 10 1/2 months apart, making them the same age for 55 days out of the year. No, that is something you plan. Well, maybe it's better to say, that wasn't the plan!

Having gone through any one of those life changes as I mentioned above, poses a bit of stress. So needless to say, I was extremely frazzled and fried beyond my endurance, exactly between the ages of 26-32.

There was pressure at home and pressure at work. Everything that could go wrong usually did. I felt like I was caught in vice grip. I couldn't escape one thing for the other. I also had major health issues and to add icing on the cake collided with a major iceberg with my own belief system

Too much, in too short of a time. I really did contemplate on packing my bags and leaving town on numerous occasions.

I often times don't look back to what has occurred during my life. What's done is done. In this instance, if Saturn returns does have some grounds, it's hard to say if my life issues could have been avoided because that means doing things differently and/or making different choices. That I cannot undo. So no sense in dwelling on the impossible.

But all an all. I lived and I learned. I guess that's a good thing. Right? But please don't tell me there's another Saturn return because I think I might just go find a nice exclusive cave to go hide in, until it passes.

Interesting topic Leisha. Thank you.

I like to think that you are…

2011-04-08T07:47:44.359Z

I like to think that you are only as young as you act Eruandil. And you gave us some real things to think about. I like your "grounded" way of thinking :)

Taking responsability for your decisions gives you a sens of control in life and I agree that it is very important to own up to your choices.

But I also think that cycles exist in our lives that do not clearly appear to us in the moment, and the planets may help to direct our attention to certain astral influences.

I also think that life does not have to "restart" at age 29, but can slowly transform or evolve according to our will.

*Neiges*

Eruandil said:

This may be seen as just the rantings of the young against those who would call them young, but I have a couple of things to say about this theory.

First, I will say that it is a given that between the ages of 20 and 32 one's mental paradigm shifts drastically, and this is most often between the ages of 26 and 30. This is due to the final death throes of the monster we call Puberty and the finishing of the human growth cycle, in a hormone wash that helps aid in things like the final inch or two of height gained, the final calcification of the ribcage and sternum, and the completion of brain development, not (from what I can tell) due to some planetary rotation.

Secondly, the standard orbit of Saturn is "29.43 Years (10,750 Days)," given the definition of exactly "365.256 days per year." Saturn has almost no chance of returning to the exact spot in relation to both the Earth and the Sun that it did during the time of your birth, because of the differences in where the Sun moves, where the Earth moves, and where Saturn moves, at their differing rates of rotation and due to their differing planes in the solar system. Even if it did have a strong chance of returning to that location in relation to all three, it would be exactly during the bi-section of your 29th year of life, not a vague six-year period.

Thirdly, while many people -do- tend to change their views, their mindsets, and their philosophies throughout this stated six-year time period, it seems presumptuous to state that every person will do that. For some people, their worldview is chiseled into stone and forged in the flames of trial throughout their life, and will not be changed by some new hardships that spring to life in this time of life. Certainly, they may re-examine these beliefs and worldviews, but they are not necessarily going to change them.

Lastly, while these beliefs and worldviews may very well change, there are so many reasons for this re-evaluation of mindset that occurs at this age that it cannot actually be tied to another planet's rotation by more than coincidence.

Be all of that as it may, I will state that I cannot see a Saturn Return changing my own personal beliefs any more than any given event changes my beliefs, as my beliefs are constantly evolving and mutating due to circumstance and personal growth anyway. And they certainly won't do a 180* spin, unless I abandon all logical process whatsoever. But that is only me, and I may well prove, yet again, to be the exception rather than the rule.

This may be seen as just the…

2011-04-07T18:54:01.977Z

This may be seen as just the rantings of the young against those who would call them young, but I have a couple of things to say about this theory.

First, I will say that it is a given that between the ages of 20 and 32 one's mental paradigm shifts drastically, and this is most often between the ages of 26 and 30. This is due to the final death throes of the monster we call Puberty and the finishing of the human growth cycle, in a hormone wash that helps aid in things like the final inch or two of height gained, the final calcification of the ribcage and sternum, and the completion of brain development, not (from what I can tell) due to some planetary rotation.

Secondly, the standard orbit of Saturn is "29.43 Years (10,750 Days)," given the definition of exactly "365.256 days per year." Saturn has almost no chance of returning to the exact spot in relation to both the Earth and the Sun that it did during the time of your birth, because of the differences in where the Sun moves, where the Earth moves, and where Saturn moves, at their differing rates of rotation and due to their differing planes in the solar system. Even if it did have a strong chance of returning to that location in relation to all three, it would be exactly during the bi-section of your 29th year of life, not a vague six-year period.

Thirdly, while many people -do- tend to change their views, their mindsets, and their philosophies throughout this stated six-year time period, it seems presumptuous to state that every person will do that. For some people, their worldview is chiseled into stone and forged in the flames of trial throughout their life, and will not be changed by some new hardships that spring to life in this time of life. Certainly, they may re-examine these beliefs and worldviews, but they are not necessarily going to change them.

Lastly, while these beliefs and worldviews may very well change, there are so many reasons for this re-evaluation of mindset that occurs at this age that it cannot actually be tied to another planet's rotation by more than coincidence.

Be all of that as it may, I will state that I cannot see a Saturn Return changing my own personal beliefs any more than any given event changes my beliefs, as my beliefs are constantly evolving and mutating due to circumstance and personal growth anyway. And they certainly won't do a 180* spin, unless I abandon all logical process whatsoever. But that is only me, and I may well prove, yet again, to be the exception rather than the rule.

Ooh la la, what a question! …

2011-04-07T08:41:45.650Z

Ooh la la, what a question!

Thank you for posting this. I had a tough time during those years, but I thought only to blame myself and my bad choices. At 26, I changed from a job to a career, went from working 37 and a half hours a week to around 70 hours as a webmaster and screwed up real bad with my friends. Finally at 30 years old, I left my b/f of ten years to start a new life and a new job in another town... left the career and took on a nice cushy 9-5 job with no stress. Then I had my daughter and son, and spent 7 years with their father.

Putting more credibility to the 7 year theory, I then left my husband, got divorced, got remarried and moved from Montreal Quebec to Paris France (over 5000 km away).

I hope the next seven-year anniversary (in 2014?) is a little less demanding. I could easily see myself getting a nice job around then. For now, I am concentrating on helping my kids with their school work, and studying myself in photography.

I don't know that I entirely…

2011-04-06T16:45:05.423Z

I don't know that I entirely buy the whole Saturn Return concept... but I personally believe in more off-the-wall concepts currently, so I'm not going to dismiss it. I am twenty six, so I'm either right at the threshold or shortly will be, though my life has been in turmoil for the last four or more years. It's actually starting to settle down, believe it or not (though I know the comments of my wife in-chat would lead one to believe otherwise).

The main problem I see with it is the timeline. It's supposed to his somewhere around the full Saturnian year, roughly 28 1/2 Earth years. This is supposed to herald a time of upheaval, change of concepts/relationships/beliefs/theories/etc... and that happened to me, roughly three years ago. I went through a massive restructuring of myself that changed my philosophies and beliefs and such drastically, and that culminated about a year or so ago, shortly after a very dramatic/traumatic time in my life. Since then, I've been laying all the peices of the puzzle back together, and I'm pretty sure I've got most of them where I want them.

... I really need to write an abridged autobiography on here, since the first one I wrote was wiped off the face of the internet by the whim of a twunt.

Anyhoo... I suppose we'll see what happens in the next few years. I hope it's not as bad as the shit I've been through recently. My wife and kids don't need that in their lives.

My Saturn Return (I just lear…

2011-04-06T03:36:41.595Z

My Saturn Return (I just learned about that concept, thank you Leisha!) started with the birth of my son, during which I toyed with my health (or rather, the doctors did, being dumb enough to think a child-sized woman could deliver an average baby with a bigger-than-average head through natural ways... Mmph). That event - including the C-section and the near state-of-shock that ensued - affected me for a good 2 years, physically, emotionally, and psychologically.

Then I had to get used to not being alone anymore. I'm a loner, to the point of being abnormal sometimes. I *need* several hours of alone time each day. With a baby, then a toddler, in the house, this was not possible. I had to get used to that, and it took me years.

All around that time, too, my mother decided that Korb was not a good father, not a good boyfriend for me, and tried hard to make me leave him. I can honestly say that I'm not sure who I was back then, but I sure as hell wasn't being me.

Things smoothed out a bit after a few years, but then my boyfriend hit his Saturn, lost his job (prompting me to get one), while his sister (also on Saturn brink) had a baby, developed bipolar syndrom, and we ended up with our newborn niece - with legal problems with the father and his family.

My Saturn ended when I discovered Witchcraft - which broke a lot of chains, forced a lot of people around me to reassess their relationships with me, and finally grounded me enough to remember who Elise truly is (CNT stint notwithstanding :p ). :)

Only at the age of 24, I alre…

2011-04-06T01:36:21.007Z

Only at the age of 24, I already had my rough spots off and on through the past 4 years. Shortly after achieving what was I thought at the time was my *dream* job, my grandmother past away. She is everything to me. When I was little I was always with her due to my parents working 2 jobs or more. I was devistated when she died. I still feel guilty for not being there in her final days, but I couldn't bring myself to seeing her all ill and in pain. I wanted to remember her as I always have, strong-willed, independent, stubborn, and my mom-mom...I still have moments where I just sit and cry because I wish she was there to just smack me upside the head for something stupid I did.

A little after that I started getting really depressed, all my friends were starting to get engaged, get married, having kids, and I had no one. I decided to give Match.com a try and was just about to give up on it when Dave found me. I was head over heels for him the moment I first saw him. He was the one. If you read my one 30 Truths blog you know we hid a giant snag/bump/brickwall, whatever. We're slowly working through it even though it's been over a year now. Just last year I had reached my whits end with my job at the karate school. I was not only doing my job as assistant manager, teaching classes, but I ended up doing pretty much most of my boss's job too (She was going through a rough time too, but not an excuse to dump shit on me) I wasn't getting compensated for the extra time/work/energy I had to put into it and I finally had enough. I came home from 2 weeks of vacation to find NOTHING was done. Not a single bank deposit, no orders, testing sheets weren't ready and testing was 2 weeks away and some students haven't even sparred once!

Anyways long story short, I'm getting my feet planted again, I have a job that I love and I know I'll succeed here. I'm walking down the path I know that is right for me, that was a big thing, I was wandering around thinking I was doing the right thing when I truly wasn't, but now that I am, I feel so much better.

Thank you for posting this Leisha, I know that I'm still young and I know I'll have more bumpy roads to come, but with a clear head and open heart I know I'll get through it all.

Bendithion,

Jen

Raises fist to Saturn Most…

2011-04-06T00:21:46.603Z

*Raises fist to Saturn*

Most everything up to age 29 was pretty much doable. Even the hardships of error were seemingly managable. A bit after turning 29, however, things indeed did begin to flip upside down with rougher hits at 30. A relocation to a town desolate in employment initiated a chain of financial woe upon which, on top of a number of other things, adversely affected all dynamics of my life. There's a bit of which I have yet to fully recover. While I take responsibility for a significant portion of the events, there yet remains an amount whereupon I scratch my head and remain dumbfounded.

In Sanatana Dharma, Saturn is known as Shani and is Hinduism's Sauron. People just don't like to even mention His name. Riding upon a vulture, Shani does pretty much everything descibed: manifest chaos. Vedic Astrology attributes His capacity to influence us every three signs the planet transits. This occurs every 2700 days, about each 7.5 years, with specific Infuences on a person each round. The big one, of course, is on the big return, by which time you are already likely finding yourself mumbling "WTF".

It's all a purge, however. No matter how life-altering or painful the changes might be, the intended outcome is aimed to be better. Destruction is Saturn's power, and once the storm has cleared, the ball is returned to your court. Still, it tends to infinitely suck at the time. It's best to placate the planet if you can. More info from Vedic astrology's view of Saturn can be found here: http://www.astromandir.com/cycle.html