Plants are people too....
Ok... not *really*....
BUT I am always baffled by the idea that plants are somehow *less* living than animals, specifically when it comes to vegetarianism. I've heard so many times "I am a vegetarian because taking a life is wrong." or "I could never, ever kill anything." So my initial question, "What do you eat?" Well the answer of course is plants. So again, I ask, how are plants *less* living than animals?
In basic interaction science, there is a visual tool called an energy pyramid that deals with the transfer of energy from one organism to another. At the bottom of the pyramid are plants who receive their energy directly from the sun. The pyramid progresses, showing energy loss, to herbivores, then omnivores, and then carnivores at the top. Therefore, from an energy stand point plants could arguably be *more* alive than animals (including humans). Those of us that work with energy can attest that there is a *lifeforce* in plants. So why is this lifeforce less important than that of animals?
I can only conclude that it is a comfort thing. Plants do not cry, whine, or do cute little animal things. It is easy to *ignore* the fact that they are indeed alive. But this is in fact a delusion. Even science is beginning to provide proof that plants communicate:
http://www.livescience.com/animals/071008-plants-communicate.html
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2007/06/070614-plants.html
Next, I would go on to ask a person providing this arguement for vegetarianism why they are incredulous when a human (humans ARE animals btw people) partakes in the eating of meat, but not when the same is done by the animals they love so much? I can assure you that the beef I eat came to a much nicer end than the antelope taken down by the lioness, or the mouse teased and tortured by your beloved house cat. Are humans now somehow above the cycle of life?
This brings me to my biggest problem with the posts I have encountered, and the reason why I have posted this here on Real Pagans. In addition to being indignant about consuming meat, *many* seem to want to push vegetarianism as a dogma of paganism or Wicca. "How can you condone the killing of innocent animals when you are pagan. Pagans are suppose to be about protecting nature." Ok.. well how about this... I am for protecting the natural balance in nature, and this means the cycle of life, which in turn means consuming meat. Not only is there absolutely no support for the claim that vegetarianism is a component of paganism as a whole or Wicca, paganism has a long history of animal sacrifice.
In addition, I ask these people, do you bathe? Do you take antibiotics? Do you wash you hands? Do you walk on the grass? All of these lead to death. But again, these deaths are easily *ignored.* The *cuteness factor* has been removed. And, again, that's what it really comes down to, your own personal comfort level. YOUR *personal* comfort level.... so do not get indignant when our level is different than yours. My path is about amplifying my connection with the divine energy of the universe, and part of that is recognizing my natural place in the cycle of life, not removing myself from it. Vegetarianism is NOT a pagan concept. Please do not try to sell it as such.
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by VLM on -
I really like this post.. and I have to say that I agree with you.
I have no issue at all with any lifestyle choice... There's definitely some benefits to vegetarianism... it's cheaper, for one. :)
But when it comes down to it, I think it's a personal choice like many others and not a necessary part of a path.
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Permalink Reply by Jennifer Renee on -
Thank you for writing this post Strata!! I am in no way a vegetarian and I respect those who choose to be but there are times when I am actually afraid to say I eat meat around other Pagans...some of them look at me like they want to EAT me!
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Permalink Reply by Makoons on -
Hear, hear Strata. This is among the reason (besides my perpetual state of illness) why I stopped being a vegetarian after 5 years. It didn't make sense. Do I think there are *better* more *humane* ways to treat farm-factory animals? Yes, I do. I don't think our place in the food chain is an excuse to overlook our ability to reason. But in the general balance and cycle of things I believe it is a person's place to eat meat.
I also get irritated when veganism/vegetarianism gets sold as a part of ANY religion. I've seen many debates that say Jesus would have been a vegetarian and so on. My belief is life is life, but not all killing is murder.
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Permalink Reply by Sutra on -
I've never had the chance or even thought to bring up your second point, the cycle of life. Usually when this topic comes up, I bring up plants, and brushing of teeth. At which point I'm called a name such as cruel or heartless and they change the subject.
For me the choice was easy. I did not want to stop eating meat, so I chose an alternative. I support local humane farms and dairies. But again this is MY choice and don't expect everyone to agree.
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Permalink Reply by Strata on
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Makoons,
I have no issue with being a vegetarian as a personal choice, but you do bring up another very valid point. Health issues. I understand, of course, that it IS possible to live a healthy life and be vegetarian, but it is something that you have to be very cautious about. I have seen way too many people decide to be vegetarians all of a sudden and not take the necessary precautions and measures to assure that they are still getting the vitamins, minerals, and amino acids that they need. They, of course, end up very sick.
Web MD Vegetarian Diet Slide Show
The Mayo Clinic: How to be a healthy Vegetarian
6 Tips for a Healthy Vegetarian Diet
Makoons said:Hear, hear Strata. This is among the reason (besides my perpetual state of illness) why I stopped being a vegetarian after 5 years. It didn't make sense. Do I think there are *better* more *humane* ways to treat farm-factory animals? Yes, I do. I don't think our place in the food chain is an excuse to overlook our ability to reason. But in the general balance and cycle of things I believe it is a person's place to eat meat.
I also get irritated when veganism/vegetarianism gets sold as a part of ANY religion. I've seen many debates that say Jesus would have been a vegetarian and so on. My belief is life is life, but not all killing is murder.
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Permalink Reply by Strata on
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Sutra, I have a great amount of respect for your choice. I wonder if you couldn't provide more information as to how others could get started with some of the steps you take. Maybe a blog, and link it here? Thanks and Love!
Sutra said:I've never had the chance or even thought to bring up your second point, the cycle of life. Usually when this topic comes up, I bring up plants, and brushing of teeth. At which point I'm called a name such as cruel or heartless and they change the subject.
For me the choice was easy. I did not want to stop eating meat, so I chose an alternative. I support local humane farms and dairies. But again this is MY choice and don't expect everyone to agree.
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Permalink Reply by Grayson on -
Right Strata! I have been a veggie since I was 18 and I have to say that..............eer, well, that I agree with you!
I became a veggie for the usual drippy hippy reason, but mainly becouse of factory farming in the UK, its not a nice sight to see them penned in, and the way chickens are dealt with was worse. But this was *works out my age minus 18* 5 or 6 years ago.........WHAT??........ok, a while ago now, and I did say that if this "freedom food" idea caught on I'd be 1st in line to nibble a cow. I used to go sea fishing a lot as a kid, little else to do on a small island, and said that if I caught my own food I'd eat it.
Well, it's been a while now and I keep thinking of going back to eating meat again, I cook it for people, I can still gut and clean a fish better than any of my friends. But whenever I think about it I cant bring me self to do it.(Taurus, once we say we are gonna do somethin, we won't change our minds!!)
Some times I really "NEED" a steak, real rare! So on those days I cook one for my guy, planning to say "yea go on then" as he usualy says "MMMMMMMMM, want some?" (bless him), but I have yet to say yes!
Shawn is right, it is cheaper being a veggie, but thats the only real perk. I WISH it would help me lose some pounds (or 10) but with all the cheese and dairy (I know, I should be a vegan or even a Jain, lol) I eat, the weight loss aint gonna happen!
Travel is a pain too, I'm in china at the moment and they like their meat, anything that moves gets it, and as a foodie, some of the stuff thats been served up looks great, but alas, I'm too conditioned now. But perhaps one day, one day, I'll grasp the sausage of destiny and eat real food again!......(but at least now my guy does eat a few more veggies than he did before, he at least now knows what a carrot tastes like.....cabbage next!)
Any how...........what was I saying? oh, yea. good post! (",)
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Permalink Reply by Tambyr (Rissa) on -
You know, I've had this same thought a couple times, but never really thought that it would make sense to someone that wasn't of the same spiritual mindset as myself. Having had conversations with some of my friends, I determined it was a lost cause. : ) But I'm glad that you brought this up, because it is definitely true. If plants need "food" to survive, then why wouldn't they be considered living? Great post. :)
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Permalink Reply by Sutra on
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I wrote a short outline of some of the humane options out there for omnivores if anyone is interested.
http://realpagan.net/profiles/blogs/an-alternative-for-meat-eaters
If anyone has any other ideas, please leave a comment.
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Permalink Reply by Strata on
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Hey JR! Thanks for your post! Have you looked at Sutra's blog?? You might enjoy it. She linked it above. :)
James Davidson said:I am a vegetarian because of environmental concerns. I see my attempts to reduce my negative impact on the Earth as being inherent in my spirituality. I find that being a vegetarian is incredibly easy for me. Therefore, eating meat and then claiming to have a spiritual connection with the Earth would not sit well with my conscience.
On the other hand, I see nothing wrong with hunting, as long as it is not done simply for sport. Hunting does not have the same environmental impact as factory farming does. Personally, I just couldn't bring myself to shoot an animal. And yes, that is because of my own "comfort level," as Strata phrased it.
I realize that these are my personal beliefs, and I do not wish to push them upon anyone. In no way do I look down upon non-vegetarians as being "bad." This is the way I choose to live, in alignment with my own belief system.
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